Talk:OggSpots

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(some better grammar and clearer vision of ideas+comments)
 
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This spec seems to supersede [[OggMNG]] (which is good, since this spec seems much more likely to be implemented), but isn't written with one of [[OggMNG]]'s use cases in mind, namely graphical subtitles and other kinds of overlays on another video stream.  To support this case, you at least need the ability to specify a transparent background colour, which seems trivial enough.  Some means of specifying whether an OggSpots stream is intended to be an overlay or not might also be nice, and this was discussed briefly in the [[OggMNG]] spec, but no decision was reached.
This spec seems to supersede [[OggMNG]] (which is good, since this spec seems much more likely to be implemented), but isn't written with one of [[OggMNG]]'s use cases in mind, namely graphical subtitles and other kinds of overlays on another video stream.  To support this case, you at least need the ability to specify a transparent background colour, which seems trivial enough.  Some means of specifying whether an OggSpots stream is intended to be an overlay or not might also be nice, and this was discussed briefly in the [[OggMNG]] spec, but no decision was reached.
 +
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:Why restricting uses? Don't these codecs stand for freedom?
 +
:Please support all cases. Overlays and not.
 +
: (A person could also state that the timed images are an overlay on the media players default background.)
 +
:OggSpots isn't replacing MNG, it's something else, MNG is a image file format.
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:OggSpots is a timed image codec.
 +
 +
: What also would be nice is having OggSpots the role of ordering images and video and pieces of a video.
 +
: For presentations, timed images are very efficient.
 +
: What if a small movie is a part of the presentation?
 +
: It would be very handy, efficient, convenient to combine it with the pictures and an OggSpot codec in one file.
 +
: Just like images by reference to parts of the video.
 +
: Notice how the OggSpot does NOT actually contain the video.
 +
: A possible application could be OggSpots defining a shorter version of a movie by describing only the parts that will be played by the shorter version. On the same way it describes images. This is very efficient way of storing the two versions.
 +
:
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:
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: The overlay stuff is taking an awfully lot of time to decide.
 +
: Maybe making a core profile with just timed images(, video) would be a good idea?
 +
: Something like e.g. OggSpots Core
 +
: The overlays can always be refined, decided later in a full version.
 +
: OggSpots Full?
 +
: In the meantime there will be at least a stable solution to do timed images.
 +
: For e.g. Presentations, album art for songs,...
 +
:
 +
:
 +
: Are these things interesting to consider, implement?
 +
[[User:Vmol|Vmol]]
Anyhoo, I think that this is an important feature for this kind of codec, so I just wanted to chime in and make sure it wasn't forgotten.  Subtitle support in [http://thoggen.net/ Thoggen] for instance, is blocking on this capability.
Anyhoo, I think that this is an important feature for this kind of codec, so I just wanted to chime in and make sure it wasn't forgotten.  Subtitle support in [http://thoggen.net/ Thoggen] for instance, is blocking on this capability.
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-- [[User:Cigaes|Cigaes]], 2006-04-15T12:01:00Z
-- [[User:Cigaes|Cigaes]], 2006-04-15T12:01:00Z
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: It would be good to have full Unicode CLDR support
 +
: CLDR: Common Locale Data Repository.
 +
: localization for everything: region, language, decimal, currency and many more
 +
:
 +
: Metadata is part of the file, therefore managing it is the job of the container.
 +
: Not the job of this or any other codec. -- [[User:Vmol|Vmol]] 2009-08-21

Latest revision as of 20:05, 21 August 2009

This spec seems to supersede OggMNG (which is good, since this spec seems much more likely to be implemented), but isn't written with one of OggMNG's use cases in mind, namely graphical subtitles and other kinds of overlays on another video stream. To support this case, you at least need the ability to specify a transparent background colour, which seems trivial enough. Some means of specifying whether an OggSpots stream is intended to be an overlay or not might also be nice, and this was discussed briefly in the OggMNG spec, but no decision was reached.

Why restricting uses? Don't these codecs stand for freedom?
Please support all cases. Overlays and not.
(A person could also state that the timed images are an overlay on the media players default background.)
OggSpots isn't replacing MNG, it's something else, MNG is a image file format.
OggSpots is a timed image codec.
What also would be nice is having OggSpots the role of ordering images and video and pieces of a video.
For presentations, timed images are very efficient.
What if a small movie is a part of the presentation?
It would be very handy, efficient, convenient to combine it with the pictures and an OggSpot codec in one file.
Just like images by reference to parts of the video.
Notice how the OggSpot does NOT actually contain the video.
A possible application could be OggSpots defining a shorter version of a movie by describing only the parts that will be played by the shorter version. On the same way it describes images. This is very efficient way of storing the two versions.
The overlay stuff is taking an awfully lot of time to decide.
Maybe making a core profile with just timed images(, video) would be a good idea?
Something like e.g. OggSpots Core
The overlays can always be refined, decided later in a full version.
OggSpots Full?
In the meantime there will be at least a stable solution to do timed images.
For e.g. Presentations, album art for songs,...
Are these things interesting to consider, implement?

Vmol

Anyhoo, I think that this is an important feature for this kind of codec, so I just wanted to chime in and make sure it wasn't forgotten. Subtitle support in Thoggen for instance, is blocking on this capability.

Jdoda

I don't think OggSpots is supposed to replace OggMNG in any way -- Jmspeex 16:41, 22 February 2006 (PST)

That's fair, though I don't see any compelling technical reasons for OggMNG if OggSpots gets off the ground. I merely wanted to point out that graphical subtitles and overlays would be a nice use for OggSpots, if the spec took them into acount, which seems like it would take only a minimal effort. -- Jdoda 19:59, 22 February 2006 (PST)

I came to OggSpots looking for a bitmap overlay format. I would like to raise a few points.

  • What is the format of the BG-color fields? The BG-color field in the header is four bytes; if these are RGBA, there is already a simple way to specify a transparent background color.
  • How to mark the end of an overlay? Stand-alone images stay until the next image starts, but overlays may end earlier. An empty image packet could do the job.
  • Metadata? Would it be useful to add a comment packet, or is metadata provided by OggSkeleton enough? And would it be useful to specify some standard key (maybe lang/language and type=overlay)?

-- Cigaes, 2006-04-15T12:01:00Z

It would be good to have full Unicode CLDR support
CLDR: Common Locale Data Repository.
localization for everything: region, language, decimal, currency and many more
Metadata is part of the file, therefore managing it is the job of the container.
Not the job of this or any other codec. -- Vmol 2009-08-21
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